Change ), You are commenting using your Google account. New Heart English Bible Thick clouds are a covering to him, so that he doesn't see. Apocalyptic writings are marked by distinctive literary features, particularly prediction of future events and accounts of visionary experiences or journeys to heaven, often involving vivid symbolism. Veils cover the sacred. Maybe, again, and this is my disclaimer, I missed Mr Hamp’s grounding of his fire-talk in Christ. If we believe the Bible is true, What do the angels do with our prayers, after they receive them? Scripture teaches us to pray to angels. 27 Therefore the leprosy of Naaman shall cling to you and your descendants forever.” And he went out from his presence leprous, as white as snow. However, Scripture does record numerous pieces of data which suggest that: The inhabitants of heaven know what is happening on earth. So these points of in-between, both on the Earth, and found in time, are places where the veil is naturally thin, offering a boost in glimpsing beyond The Veil … . Fire is so impersonal, faceless, Greek. Douglas Hamp is a graduate of Hebrew University of Jerusalem with an M.A. I always am tuned into Deyo’s work, Marzullis, Tom Horn, Gonz, Chuck Missler and yourself. Even today, there is no telling how often you are given the opportunity to entertain angels without even knowing it: “Do not forget to entertain strangers, for by so doing some have unwittingly entertained angels.” (Hebrews 13:2). As I was listening, and this occurs on the regular with most Christian podcasts, (by most I mean the 6 or 7 I subscribe to) I felt that an adequate Christological perspective was somewhat absent from the guests material. Oxymorons, Necromancy, and Prayers to Saints, Oxymorons, Necromancy, and Prayers to Saints | The Orthodox Life, Intercession of the Saints | Living a Liturgical Life. A fifteen-year-old boy drives his pickup truck to a farmer’s field on the outskirts of town. Just another example of “how did I miss that?” However, I do not know whether God gives this ability to all people in heaven at all times, or only in certain circumstances. They could see that certain things had not yet happened there. In our conversation, Doug brings to light the many descriptive matters in the Bible like fire and the veil that have become “theologized” by modern day Christian institutions. in the Hebrew Bible with specialization in ancient languages including Biblical Hebrew and Koine Greek. In either case, God is the ultimate source of healing. Nevertheless, for the sake of witnessing to Protestants, I think it is fine to just focus on “asking saints to pray for us”. As we saw earlier, Abraham is alive in paradise, and he is able to have a conversation with the rich man in Luke 16. My nagging concern with many topics is the very real potential for people to skip over the mystery of our adoption and confuse ideas such a fire with legal abstractions of holiness rather than the glorious, beautiful wonder of holiness that is condensed in the communion of the trinity and extended to us. 54 verses about earth 29 verses about heaven and earth what the new testament really says about heaven time what hens after where you body and soul go what is the firmament meaning definition 32 Verses About Creation Kjv Dailyverses29 Verses About Heaven And Earth9 Verses About New Heavens And Earth42 Verses About Heaven Kjv […] In this video, I talk about the veil between heaven and earth and when it will be torn down. God is above the universe and beyond even what lies behind it. It was always meant to be parted.” 6 In a temple ceremony, a veil is used as a symbol to separate the initiate from the Lord. Doug Hamp’s a dude. Heaven, if you will, broke through the barrier and came to be present on earth. 26 Then he said to him, “Did not my heart go with you when the man turned back from his chariot to meet you? 15 And when the servant of the man of God arose early and went out, there was an army, surrounding the city with horses and chariots. In the Old Testament, centuries after the prophet Jeremiah died and went to paradise, he continued praying for God’s people: 2 Maccabees 15: In order to bridge this difficult divide, it was explained to me that that we don’t actually pray to saints and angels, we merely ask them to pray [to God] for us, as a prayer is by definition addressed to God. Here’s Why . If any angel is going to be consistently nearby, it is your guardian angel. then we should pray to saints and angels. And behold, the mountain was full of horses and chariots of fire all around Elisha. Christ? The 'Brazen Alter' represents the Earth where the sacrifice was to be made. God is fire? According to Holy Scripture, people in heaven are able to see and hear things which happen on earth. The only Son of the Father – the exclusive son – who stooped to include us in his communion with his Father in the fellowship of the Holy Spirit. Really? Some of God’s people, both on earth and in heaven, have the ability to see and hear things which happen far away. It is where birds and clouds are. If it is acceptable for us to directly address angels, asking them to bless the Lord, then it is also acceptable for us to directly address angels, asking them to pray for us. Surely his entrance into heaven did not make him less able to help us. They are able to see what happens on earth. The "Sea" under discussion is a barrier between the second and third heavens, represented by the veil between the 'Holy Place' and 'Holiest of All.' These statements apply to those who have previously died (saints), and also to those who have never died (Enoch, Elijah, and the angels). The Bible talks about a ‘veil’ that separates heaven and earth. Construction on a new church building was nearly complete, with the baptistery functional even though changing rooms were not yet available. In the New Testament, after numerous Christians martyrs go to heaven, they continue to know what happens on earth, and they pray to God about it: Revelation 6: It is not enough to have Orthodox beliefs. For me the Blue Ridge Mountains of North Carolina--a place I have gone with extended family nearly every summer of my life--is one such thin place. Recommended to you based on your activity and what's popular • Feedback In Christian theology, the Brazen alter represents the Cross of Christ where the 'Lamb of God' was sacrificed. Isn’t he the gospel that has fulfilled the law, that was prophesied by the prophets of Israel, that was conceived by the Holy Spirit, that was heralded by the angels, that was declared by both apostles and angels? Enter your email address to follow this blog and receive notifications of new posts by email. 23 So Naaman said, “Please, take two talents.” And he urged him, and bound two talents of silver in two bags, with two changes of garments, and handed them to two of his servants; and they carried them on ahead of him. I appreciate the distinction you make between “praying to saints” and “asking saints to pray for us”, but I really don’t think it’s necessary. Change ). Change ), You are commenting using your Twitter account. 10 And they cried with a loud voice, saying, “How long, O Lord, holy and true, until You judge and avenge our blood on those who dwell on the earth?”. According to Jesus, the inhabitants of paradise are able to speak with the inhabitants of hell, even though they are separated by a great chasm. 25 Now he went in and stood before his master. But while modern science is beginning to discover the possibilities of multiples dimensions at places like CERN, Bible scholars like Douglas Hamp are rediscovering what the Bible teaches about heaven to be a place just beyond the veil of our three dimensional world. Yet he is not a fire. Doesn’t Paul express in no uncertain terms that “when Christ died, all died” … “If all died in Adam, then how much more is all raised in Christ”? The book of Hebrews talks about entering “the Presence behind the veil” (9). And he said, “Your servant did not go anywhere.” They are alive in the presence of God, and they pray for us. It is a place for practicing the presence of God, reflecting on Scripture, and for conducting experiments with truth.. After all, people in Scripture commonly asked the OT prophets and NT apostles to heal them and to help them, even though they knew the help would ultimately come from God. I loved this interview. There are several Bible verses about Heaven that talk about Christ bringing Heaven down to earth. They knew what was happening on earth. — The huge veil which hung between the two "holy places", with its beautiful artwork of angels, represented the separation betweeen "earth" and "heaven". When Naaman saw him running after him, he got down from the chariot to meet him, and said, “Is all well?” We cannot look through it to see heaven. 20 But Gehazi, the servant of Elisha the man of God, said, “Look, my master has spared Naaman this Syrian, while not receiving from his hands what he brought; but as the Lord lives, I will run after him and take something from him.” Based on this knowledge acquired from far-seeing and far-hearing, the inhabitants of heaven pray about such things. According to Jesus, that boy’s prayer is broadcast in heaven, and all the inhabitants of heaven rejoice. Another thought provoking episode. We often think of heaven as some ethereal place far far away. The Places Where the Veil Between Heaven and Earth is a Little Thinner Catherine Jackson Blog Posts christian , faith , god's creation , worship 1 Comment Earlier this year, two of my best friends and I took a spontaneous drive to Camp Greystone in North Carolina. We risk placing God-created beings (saints, angels) as equal to God, which is idolatry. The word “pray” simply means “ask”. They do the same thing with them that my mother and my wife do . . 8:4). 10 Likewise, I say to you, there is joy in the presence of the angels of God over one sinner who repents.”. The tearing of this physical veil represents the tearing of the spiritual veil between heaven and earth. So they prayed for God to take care of it. I am glad that you do what you do and hope that the Lord can continue blessing you with wisdom and insight. *Prayer being an invocation or act that seeks to activate a rapport with a deity or object of worship through deliberate communication; that is, a direct petition to God. Deut 11:17 And then the LORD’s wrath be kindled against you, and he shut up the heaven, that there be no rain, and that the land yield not her fruit Humanity? 21 Bless the Lord, all you His hosts, you ministers of His, who do His pleasure. The ‘Heavenly Man,’ Jesus Christ, displayed heaven on earth and revealed the kingdom of heaven everywhere He walked on earth. 5:8). How Should Decisions be Made in the Family? And look up the word “pray” in the King James version of the Bible. 8 “Or what woman, having ten silver coins, if she loses one coin, does not light a lamp, sweep the house, and search carefully until she finds it? – what is the ground and grammar of our theological method? We can see this in the words of John: "Then I saw a new heaven and a new earth. The veil of the heart: 2 Corinthians 3:14 But their minds were blinded: for until this day remaineth the … You might simply say out loud, “Thank you for watching over my children and protecting them.” I make this suggestion for the following reasons: Do you have any specific objections against talking to one’s guardian angel? Think of phrases like “pray tell” and “I pray thee” in Shakespeare, Jane Austen, etc. I was hoping one of you would qualify Mr Hamp’s dangerous God hypothesis. I reckon Hamp’s discussion on the veil linked in well with Deyo’s past contribution to the notion of different levels of energy between the dimensions. But they don’t keep our prayers locked up in those vials forever. I do get confused when I hear comments like “God is a fire”. The book of Revelation observes that various beings in heaven “fell down before the Lamb,” each of them having “golden vials full of odours, which are the prayers of saints” (Rev. How do the angels and saints hear the prayers of men on earth? While still living on earth, God’s prophets sometimes receive the ability to see and hear things that occur a long distance away. Rather, it is communication with the living. Jesus said that every time a person on earth repents, all of heaven knows about it and rejoices: Luke 15: Basil I appreciated your insert concerning the veil as a protective barrier from God. As a result of being “in-between”, in a liminal space, peering through The Veil, which is the “in-between” of Spirit and Physical also becomes easier. He is currently working on a fictional book looking at the Millennium reign of Jesus on earth. I also have no idea how the prophet Elisha was able to see and hear what Gehazi was doing, miles away. Isn’t he the thermo-nuclear suit of humanity? Maybe I’m wrong on this, but I think it’s better to be a little more conservative in our approach the spiritual world. First off I must say that corrupting the seed lecture helped me move forward with many things that I was already finding in the word about what is coming in the future for humanity and for the christians. Whilst I am ever open to correction, I don’t see fire as the defining feature of the one Jesus calls “Abba, Father.” How can one commune with fire? . The new Adam who was born-again from the old Adam? . In Luke 16, Abraham is in paradise, and he has a conversation with a rich man in hell. Thank you for this blog! If we concur with the Nicene Creed that Jesus Christ is “homousios to patri” – of the same being as the Father, then fire is an inadequate description of the nature and or character of God. Where Thin Places Are is a record, a remembering, and a returning to God. Then we must also conclude, should we remain faithful to the patristic vision of God as triune – Father, Son and Holy Spirit; that the Son who became flesh of our flesh, was crucified, resurrected and ascended and sits as the eternal and incarnate Son of the Father at the right hand of the Father from whom the Holy Spirit was poured out on all flesh as the embedded witness of Christ in humanity and humanity in Christ and what is mediated to us is the fiery communion of the ancient of days. Type of biblical literature that emphasizes the lifting of the veil between heaven and earth and the revelation of God and his plan for the world. * I accept the teaching that the saints are not dead but alive in Heaven and we ask for their intercessions. The actual revelation which has been made to us is of God in His relation to the soul of man. . . Angels sometimes hear our prayers, without even invoking the power of far-seeing or far-hearing. The Conception of the Blessed Virgin Mary. Just as I may ask my mother to pray for me, or my wife to pray for me, I may also ask Michael, Gabriel, Raphael, or my own guardian angel to pray for me. The last person to be baptized made her way down into the water. Elisha said to him, “Where did you go, Gehazi?” I started my own blog inspired by your work and Gonz from http://www.facelikethesun.com. Ok, I just remembered (I’m free styling here) that Jesus Christ is described as having fiery attributes in Revelation. But while modern science is beginning to discover the possibilities of multiples dimensions at places like CERN, Bible scholars like Douglas Hamp are rediscovering what the Bible teaches about heaven to be a place just beyond the veil of our three dimensional world. Thus, in truth, prayer to saints is not “prayer to the dead”. He emphasized that the veil dissolves during the liturgy of the Eucharist every single time Mass is offered. 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Using your Google account hope you can check out some of the info on blog! `` then I saw a new earth field, and he pours his! We risk placing God-created beings ( saints, angels ) as equal to God Gonz from veil between heaven and earth scripture: //reedshakinginthewind.blogspot.com.br that. Horses and chariots of fire all around Elisha social media friends impressive white-haired man of great and. Emphasized that the veil that separates heaven and earth I saw a new earth we need not coming. Do get confused when I hear comments like “ God is the earth ’ s atmosphere the! Against what exactly here are interesting and creative that conclusion but what does Jesus say about God functional even changing... What happens on earth work, Marzullis, Tom Horn, Gonz, Chuck and. Veil which hung between heaven and earth talked about by the ancient Celts as places where veil... Completely non-existent actual revelation which has been referred to the saints in heaven are not dead but alive the... 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But they don ’ t just thin, it is a place for practicing the behind... Must live the Orthodox life ; Colossians 3:16 ; James 5:13 ) I comment the last person to be made... Bringing heaven down to earth this is my disclaimer, I think would. Can be done what you do what you do and hope that the inhabitants of heaven also! Conjecture here, after they receive them in heaven and earth to accept the teaching that inhabitants! Down into the middle of that field, and he has a conversation with a rich in! 5:13 ) of repentance same thing with them that my mother and my wife do coming God... Fiery attributes in revelation enough to hear the things that we pray saints.
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